Tuesday, February 19, 2008

#6

Jon Heyman of Sports Illustrated rated the top 10 GM's of Major League Baseball, and amazingly enough Corey and my names were omitted from the list...oh, well there's always next year. A peculiar name did appear on the list though- Patty G. Yep, in Heyman's eyes Pat Gillick is the sixth best general manager in MLB.

Top 10:
1. Theo Epstein
2. Billy Beane
3. Dave Dombrowski
4. Mark Shapiro
5. Brian Cashman
6. Pat Gillick
7. Josh Byrnes
8. Omar Minaya
9. Dan O'Dowd
10T. Kenny Williams
*10T. Kevin Towers

*By my rough estimate that's actually 11...poor schmuck can't count.

Gillick hasn't exactly rocked my socks off, but he has made some decent deals. Good deals- Brad Lidge & Eric Bruntlett, So Taguchi, Tadahito Iguchi, Jamie Moyer, JC Romero, Kyle Lohse, Jeff Conine, Rick White, Greg Dobbs, Jayson Werth, and David Delluci. Bad Deals- Adam Eaton, Ryan Franklin, Abraham Nunez, Jose Mesa, Wes Helms, Sal Fasano, Julio Santana, Vicente Padilla, Alex Gonzalez, Rod Barajas, Freddy Garcia, and Bobby Abreu & Cory Lidle. Time will tell- Pedro Feliz, Geoff Jenkins, Kris Benson, and Tom Gordon (leaning towards bad). Seems to me that there are far more negatives than positives, but I guess Heyman wasn't counting correctly again.

~Carson

12 comments:

GM-Carson said...

From Buster Olney's blog-
Pat Burrell, the Phillies' left fielder, had a nice second half last season and helped propel Philadelphia into the playoffs. I asked some talent evaluators to give their assessment of Burrell:

From an NL scout: "He went the other way a lot more in the second half; he didn't try to pull everything. Before that, it was as if he saw the short fence [in Philly] and saw nothing but home runs. It seemed like in the second half of last year, he figured out that the home runs would come by accident, and he tried to hit the ball the other way.

"It'll be interesting to see him this year. He's painful to watch, because of his physical problems, but it's his free-agent year. He'll either sell out and try to hit a lot of home runs and try to be an AL-type DH, or he'll keep taking steps to becoming a more rounded player and a guy who hits to all fields. He may feel pressure to make up for some of the offense that they lose with Aaron Rowand leaving.

"It depends on which Burrell shows up. If the stubborn Burrell shows up, he will slide back big time. … The best way is still to pitch him is soft stuff down and away, and hard stuff in -- but you'd better get it in on him. If you miss with hard stuff in, he'll kill you."

From an AL talent evaluator: "Pat controls the strike zone extremely well, but he was way too pull-happy for the majority of the season last year, and was fortunate that he was playing half his games at Citizen's Bank Park as he was no doubt a beneficiary of its small dimensions [see home/road splits].

"I like his ability to control the strike zone, and he does at times become somewhat of a force at the plate [when he stays back, lets the ball travel, and therefore becomes more willing and particularly able to utilize the opposite field], which is what he did during the second half of last year [until he slowed down in September]. However, besides his ability to occasionally nail a runner trying to stretch a single into a double, he lacks even average defensive abilities. … He's basically a guy that you could get some power and on-base out of in your lineup (but that could conceivably hit 7th for a good club), but would be a liability defensively and on the bases. … I don't think his numbers will vary much in '08 from where they've been the last three years, provided he stays healthy."

From an AL scout: "I didn't see the Phillies a lot in the second half of last year, but in general, I'm not big on big right-handed hitting guys who strike out a lot; he either walks or hits home runs when he doesn't make outs, and he doesn't help you defensively or on the bases. For a good team, Burrell hitting No. 3, 4 or 5 is not going to help you. He still is better suited to hit No. 6 or No. 7. He's got a high-maintenance swing, and that means he's going to have some cold spots and some hot spots.

furiousBall said...

how is the Brad Lidge not in the Time will tell category?

Daniel said...

isn't it John Heyman? Nickname: Buster ??

GreggyD said...

I'm anxious to see what Burrell will do on the field this year. I am trying to give him the benefit of the doubt because he did come on so strong during the second half last season At the same time I can't get the image of him sticking his ass out at an "inside" pitch and striking out looking or hacking at something low and in the dirt. Hopefully he steps it up in his contract year like Rowand did and puts up career numbers.

Gillick...#6??? The owners must have slipped the writer some cash to put that in there because everyone and their mother knows Gillick has been pretty subpar in terms of bringing in major league talent. I'm sure siralden would go off on me about how many draft picks we have because of him and yes this is good, but at the same time I'd like to see some players brought in that will make a difference now. This city can often be known as a "what have you done for me lately" kind of town and Gillick didn't fit in so well in that regard.

Mike said...

Bruntlett might turn out to be the next No-Hit Nunez, except without the fielding skills. (But, at least he only makes 600K.)

The multi-year contracts to Romero, Jenkins, Eaton, and Feliz don't look too good now, and could be even more damaging in the future.

They might have been better off going with Snelling over Taguchi, especially at half the price.

Gillick did really badly in the big deals (Thome, Abreu), but he didn't have much leverage in those situations.

He's definitely better than Wade, but doesn't seem like he should be in the top 10.

I'm a big Burrell fan, and would like to see him back in '09.
But, unless the NL starts using the DH in '09, I just don't see it happening.

GM-Carson said...

I view the Lidge trade as good because it put Myers back in the rotation where I've always felt he belonged.

I don't see Burrell having a career year, I see him having a typical year .260 30 HR 100 RBI.

GM-Carson said...

Let's not forget the big Ryan Howard arbitration hearing is set for tomorrow. My prediction- Phils win.

GreggyD said...

Phils should definitely win tomorrow. I don't see any reason for an arbiter to rule in favor of Howard. He'll have to "suck it up" and "only" take $7 million.

GM-Carson said...

I won't make 7 million in the span of my lifetime.

SirAlden said...

Great balanced post, I would add the Jim Thome Trade as GREAT TRADE
by Gillick. Just so happens I wrote about it for Beerleaguer today.

"Sadly the Beerleaguer board is populated with some people who are so negative, if they stood there and witnessed the Second Coming of Christ, they would moan, whine, and complain: “JESUS! Jesus Christ! What in the HELL TOOK YOU SO LONG!”.

My hatred for the inherited wealth ownership is well documented. I do admire what Pat Gillick has been able to do while operating within the restrictions of that ownership.

I would like to thank all the positive posters who are now appearing to help balance the negativity.

Here is but One Example:

“Thome trade (2 seasons of Rowand but required them to give up a bunch of money and the Phils have nothing to show today for it)”
So this is a very clear statement.

NOTHING. Zero. (Two, if you count the Rowand seasons which he does not care about).

Now lets see if this is Correct. Remember. NOTHING. NADDA. ZERO.

Here is what we have to show for the “Thome trade” in descending order of importance. We would not have these things if the “Thome trade” had not been made by General Manager Pat Gillick in 11/05.

1) The 2007 NL East Flag which will always be a part of Phillies History. The Greatest Comeback in Phillies History would not have occurred (to break the curse of 1964) without Aaron Rowand, and Ryan Howard’s 47 HR’s, 94 Runs, 136 RBI’s, and 309 Total Bases vs. “Gentleman” Jim Thome’s stats of 35 HR’s, 79 Runs, 96 RBI’s, and 243 Total Bases during 2007, there would be no Pennant.

2) Ryan Howard’s 2006 single season record of 58 HR’s as a Phillie.

3) Ryan Howard’s 2006 modern day record of 383 total bases. Fourth in Phillies History, behind only the Chuck Klein’s Major League Record of 445 total bases in 1930, his 420 total bases in 1932, and 405 total bases in 1929.

4) The 2006 MVP season of Ryan Howard - 58 HR’s, 104 Runs, 149 RBI’s, and 383 Total Bases.

5) The 2007 season of Ryan Howard - 47 HR’s, 94 Runs, 136 RBI’s, and 309 Total Bases.

6) The 2007 season of Aaron Rowand - 27 HR’s, 105 Runs, 89 RBI’s, and 315 Total Bases.

7) The 2006 season of Aaron Rowand – which included the Greatest Catch in Phillies History when he ran into the fence, forever earning him fan adoration and the nickname ‘fence-face’ and future Philly U-Tube admirers.

8) The Phillies saved $21,500,000 Dollars on Thome’s Contract. Money that was available to sign Taguchi and Lohse during the 2007 stretch run.

9) The 34th Pick in the upcoming 2008 MLB Draft to the Phillies (for loss of Type A Aaron Rowand to Giants).

10) The 46th Pick in the upcoming 2008 MLB Draft to the Phillies (for loss of Type A Aaron Rowand to Giants).

11) LHP Gio Gonzalez who was lost when traded back for RHP Freddie Garcia. Gio should be good, but it should be noted that he is still in the minors and has been traded 3 times, and twice by the White Sox.

12) LHP Fabio ‘Model Dictator’ Castro – who is now on the Phillies 40 Man Roster.


Comments made at the time of the trade…

By ROB MAADDI, AP Sports Writer
November 23, 2005 “…. Thome, an oft-injured first baseman, is owed $43.5 million in the final three seasons of his $85 million, six-year contract. He hit .207 with seven homers and 30 RBIs in just 193 at-bats last season.”

From MLB Rumors
“Once you add it all up, receiving Jim Thome and $22MM for Aaron Rowand, Haigwood (who was later traded for Fabio Castro), and a Gio Gonzalez is nowhere near a good deal for the Sox. As proposed, this is simply way too much value for the White Sox to give up for Thome”.


None of these things would have happened if the trade had not occurred. Rowand, salary relief, plus two minor league pitchers was the best offer available at the time. The White Sox have the 2008 season and then and option for the 2009, then his contract like Rowand’s is up, at a position we could not use him.

So is the answer ZERO? NOTHING? Or maybe two? No it is not. The trade cleared the path for all 12 of these things to occur. Without the trade none of these things would ever have happened. I for one, am thankful for every single one of them."

GM-Carson said...

I actually view the Jim Thome trade slightly on the bad side. Aaron Rowand was a very nice chip to get in the swap, but we're STILL paying the White Sox.

SirAlden said...

I will take my 12 things, with the two up coming draft picks # 34 and # 46. Without the trade no NL East Pennant.

But I will fight to the death, to support your disagreement.